Author Topic: Vaccine passport  (Read 3077 times)

Offline OhhKarim

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Vaccine passport
« on: 14 03, 2021, 04:49:28 pm »
A while ago skeptics and "conspiracy theorists" claimed that this plandemic would lead into several big changes in the world, one of them being vaccine passports. It was brushed off as too crazy of an idea, and that conspiracy theorists were out of their mind, however it has seem to become a potential reality. Do you agree with the concept of a vaccine passport? What if they start with restricting air-travel without this passport, but later on restricting more functions such as allowing you to enter the supermarket? Share your thoughts. Some videos are stated below to give you some more information.






Offline Pilovali

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #1 on: 14 03, 2021, 05:15:02 pm »
Vaccine passport? Oh hell no!
Maybe a test passport, but no vaccine passport.

There are people that don't want to be vaccined due to religion or for whatever reason. This shouldn't mean they get very limited in their freedom.
It reminds me of what happend during the WW2 in Europe. Jews weren't allowed in certain parks or stores because they're Jewish. If there is a vaccine passport, people without them aren't allowed to enter certain places.
« Last Edit: 14 03, 2021, 05:17:20 pm by Pilovali »

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Offline OhhKarim

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #2 on: 14 03, 2021, 05:49:14 pm »
Vaccine passport? Oh hell no!
Maybe a test passport, but no vaccine passport.

Funny thing is, people are already required to provide evidence that they had tested negative before they are deemed eligible to travel, with a suggested quarantine after arrival as well. There is no need to make this even more severe by adding a vaccine passport, it should be a fundamental right to face no consequences from the government for not wanting to inject substances into your body.

There are people that don't want to be vaccined due to religion or for whatever reason. This shouldn't mean they get very limited in their freedom.
It reminds me of what happend during the WW2 in Europe. Jews weren't allowed in certain parks or stores because they're Jewish. If there is a vaccine passport, people without them aren't allowed to enter certain places.

True.

Offline GaMeFeR

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #3 on: 14 03, 2021, 06:33:45 pm »
Time ago my friends have told me that in order to proceed in their flight they should do COVID test or you wont be able to flight I hope this ''vaccine passport'' aint mean to be that you need it in order to flight because for sure many people doesnt want to be vaccined as stated above because their religion or whatever reason, many people doesnt want to be vaccined for more reasons not only those stated previously, there's some risk in being vaccined most of the people that took the COVID-19 vaccine passed out for some reasons now half of the world is scared to be vaccined.

Let's just hope that we wouldn't need of this ''Vaccine passport'' or this will be a way to force people to get vaccined agaisn't COVID-19.
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Offline OhhKarim

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #4 on: 14 03, 2021, 10:53:15 pm »
Although, I don't really care about how all of this will pan out since I already took the decision to be vaccinated

> I won't be affected by it so I don't care that it offends the rights of other people.

Perfect narcissism.

I already have my green passport and It feels good sitting inside a restaurant and/or a bar for the first time in a year

I can already do that in my country since several months, without needing a passport.

but if the vaccine should make me immune or not able to get hurt by the virus if I have it does it matter if someone else doesn't get it?

If the vaccine is working perfectly fine then why do people still need to wear masks even after they get vaccinated? Might as well not take the vaccination if it doesn't change anything considering I'm already wearing a mask, and wearing it by my own will.

Quote
So given the uncertainty around transmission, even people who are immunized must continue to protect others by wearing masks, experts said. “They should wear masks until we actually prove that vaccines prevent transmission,” said Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute for Allergy and Infectious Diseases.Mar 4, 2021

Offline Pollux

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #5 on: 15 03, 2021, 11:53:54 am »
DeathWish explained everything, but yeah. In Israel you're basically limited if you do not take the vaccine, vaccine passport here makes your life much easier.

Without it you cannot enter shopping centers, sit inside a restaurant/bar, go to the movies, or anything that contains indoors activity.

The Israel population is 9 million people, and as of today, 5,000,000 people took the first vaccine shot and 4,000,000 took the second one. And all that is due to the pressure and difficulty we'd face if we do not take the vaccine.

I personally think what the government has done is very effective. In fact, starting next month, citizens of Israel will not be forced to wear a facial mask anymore, and that's due to the huge amount of people getting vaccinated.
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Offline Pilovali

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #6 on: 15 03, 2021, 11:56:20 am »
In Israel you're required to take an untested vaccine. In a few countries in Europe they're stopping with a one vaccine brand cus people get trombone.
If you don't get a vaccine, you can say goodbye to your normal life. That's discrimination. People should be free with whatever they wanna do.

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Offline Pollux

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #7 on: 15 03, 2021, 12:00:59 pm »
In Israel you're required to take an untested vaccine. In a few countries in Europe they're stopping with a one vaccine brand cus people get trombone.
If you don't get a vaccine, you can say goodbye to your normal life. That's discrimination. People should be free with whatever they wanna do.

Untested vaccine? All vaccines are not tested enough, we cannot know the long-term side effects of any vaccine since we didn't have time to test any of them for the long-term side effects.

It is what it is, people who don't want to trust the government are gonna have to say goodbye to their normal life, yes.

And, people are free to not take the vaccine, but sooner or later they're gonna realize what a stupid decision they've taken, they basically threw their daily life routines to the trash bin.
Albert Einstein wrote, “Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”

Offline Pilovali

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #8 on: 15 03, 2021, 12:05:09 pm »
And what if you all get sick in a year? Like you said, vaccine isn't tested long term.
People should be free to choose and should NOT be forced by anybody. Israel is forcing people to take it.
No vaccine = no access to anything.


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Offline Pollux

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #9 on: 15 03, 2021, 12:09:39 pm »
Well, if you're an Israeli citizen and very convinced that you don't want to take the vaccine you're gonna have to live with it.

Basically all you can do is buy your groceries from neighborhood stores (basic people who don't ask for the passport). When at a restaurant, you have to sit outside, no sitting inside. Buy clothes from basic street stores/poor neighborhoods etc... It is quite harsh decisions from the government, but we have to accept it. People cannot come to the government with complains all about zero income and businesses crashing down, but then saying they don't want to take the vaccine. If they want to make a living they have to quit whining and take the vaccine to live a normal life, that's the only choice.
Albert Einstein wrote, “Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”

Offline Shomy

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #10 on: 15 03, 2021, 05:29:39 pm »
In Serbia we got 5 different vaccines , now 6th is coming, and we are starting to produce our own Sputnik vaccine. incapable  imbecils from EU will make big discrimination towards non American and non Europe related vaccines.
Serbia is second or third in the World with number of vaccinated people per 100k population, even tho looks like ones who didn't took Pfizer or some other vaccine from some rich ass bussinessman won't be able to move across the EU.
So yeah USA, UK and EU imbecils has this logic:

If you take  Russian vaccine, you can't pass the borders.
If you take vaccine from China, you can't pass the borders.
If you take vaccine from India you can't pass the borders.
If you take vaccine from Biden's political enemy, you can't pass the borders.
If you take vaccine from company that refused to pay taxes for Queen's 5 000 000 worth of shoes, you can't pass the borders.
If you take sugar water made by Bill Gates, you may walk around the World much as you want.

Thrut is,EU has finally showed the real face of it's unstable ass, their arogant  presentation of power showed that they are just stupid managment with a lot of money, without a brain.
You really think that new "type" of Covid 19 would ever appear in Britain if there was no "Brexit", that new "type" doesn't even exist, it's their revange to Britain for being smarter then rest of EU, nothing else.
About Pfizer vaccine, Germany and USA invested lot's of money in it, they want their money back from YOU buying it. I agree with plan that people who got vaccinated will have benefits, but if people have to be vaccinated by speciffic one, that's elephant's huge bullshit.
(You won't buy it directly, they will just build up some taxes for, I don't know, Biden's new dog's house or something)

Take example of current situation from Croatia, Albania and Serbian land of Kosovo, their people got vaccinated more in Serbia then in their own country, because they have to wait Germany and USA with their NATO forces (Military units) to secure themselves, and after that "garbage" countries will MAYBE, get  some doses some day.  ( I say garbage countries meaning on economy of  countries that got destroyed by EU's selfish cash inhale in their own butts.).

DON'T LISTEN TO MEDIA, IF YOU THINK YOU SHOULD TAKE VACCINE TO FEEL SAFE, DO IT, TAKE ANY YOU CAN FIND IN YOUR COUNTRY, NO MATTER IF IT'S FROM BULGARIA, CHAD, UZBEKISTAN, THEY ARE ALL THE SAME, SOME OF THEM WILL WORK FASTER IN YOUR ORGANISM, SOME WILL TAKE MORE TIME, BUT THEY ARE ALL THE SAME, YOU DO THAT FOR YOURSELVES, DONT' BE BLACKMAILED TO USE WHAT USA AND EU TELL YOU TO DO.


« Last Edit: 15 03, 2021, 05:34:45 pm by Shomy »

Offline OhhKarim

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #11 on: 15 03, 2021, 07:05:58 pm »
Oh yes I don't give a flying fuck tbh about anyone else if and my family are healthy then why would I care about someone else? Do I look like WHO to you?

You don't have to explain how narcissistic you are, I've already noticed that since a while ago.

What? Should I say congratz? This isn't an achievement

You don't have to say anything, it was just in regards to the embarrassing statement you said where you tried to make it seem like its something positive that you are finally able to go restaurants only now after a year, while having a "green card" when meanwhile I've been able to do so freely for several months without requiring any "green card", forced vaccination or any other pathetic rule such as the rules in israel.

People still wear maks and lockdown still in place because I believe we don't have sufficient data to say that the vaccine works

Imagine being such a sheep that you're deciding to get vaccinated without even knowing if it's completely operating as supposed.

Which brings us back to the main topic why in the flying fuck are you making people take the vaccine when you don't have enough info? If someone wants to take it it should because they want to not be because they must do it to live a normal UNTIL it's proven that it is working then it should a must like other vaccines

At least you said one normal thing in your whole reply. So what's up with the initial reply where you're saying you don't care?



DeathWish explained everything, but yeah. In Israel you're basically limited if you do not take the vaccine, vaccine passport here makes your life much easier.

Without it you cannot enter shopping centers, sit inside a restaurant/bar, go to the movies, or anything that contains indoors activity.

That's exactly the issue sherlock. Clearly invading people's rights, but israel is professional in invading people's rights (and lands) so I'm not surprised they're already enforcing these ideas.



I personally think what the government has done is very effective. In fact, starting next month, citizens of Israel will not be forced to wear a facial mask anymore, and that's due to the huge amount of people getting vaccinated.

Wearing a mask shouldn't be forced even if none took a vaccination, if I decide to put myself at a health risk, then it's my choice. Alcohol and cigarettes are both legal in israel, 8000 people die every year in israel as a result of cigarettes which is already more than the deaths of covid19 in israel, which are around 6000. This isn't about safety, it's about control, and even if you believe it's about health safety, it's none of the governments' business, which again brings me back to alcohol and cigarettes to prove the pure hypocrisy. In case you say "actually, the virus is contagious so innocent people will be hurt", there are 2 flaws to that logic, firstly alcohol also causes deaths and injuries to innocent bystanders, and so does cigarettes, it causes second hand smoke deaths. Lastly, the second flaw, is that if you are so scared of getting infected by someone else, it's your own choice to stay at home, you should not rely on the action of others. So this argument is already completely debunked and there's no other argument that can be used.

Offline Norman

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #12 on: 15 03, 2021, 08:15:34 pm »
the problem with you is you are thinking about it as if the government made it and forces it, yet you forget its our doctors and scientists that are among us who made these vaccines and they are the ones who recommend it.

just like if you got a problem with anything in your life, you got to an expert to find you a solution or a fix, and in this situation its those medical experts who came with a solution.

I dont think any of you is any smarter and more experienced than actual doctors and scientists who all their life revolves about things like this.
just like you trust your plumber to fix your broken sink and blocked drain, or your technician to fix your TV and Mobile phone, you should trust them.

also to remind you all, SARS virus isn't new to us and it had a vaccine too(Covid-19 is part of SARS family), it was tested and released the same period that Covid-19 vaccine is.
yet you dont hear about SARS anymore?



You don't have to say anything, it was just in regards to the embarrassing statement you said where you tried to make it seem like its something positive that you are finally able to go restaurants only now after a year, while having a "green card" when meanwhile I've been able to do so freely for several months without requiring any "green card", forced vaccination or any other pathetic rule such as the rules in israel.

Living in a 3rd world country that has one of the lowest healthcare system in the world that doesn't care about an on-going global pandemic isn't a thing to be proud of too...is it?

I do not say that what Israel is doing is right or wrong in its way of dealing with this spreading virus, but it is doing something about it atleast.
It raced to be the first country with the most vaccination percent in the world and be "proof" that the world needs, Cause Israel actually believes in Technology and medicine.
Wearing a mask shouldn't be forced even if none took a vaccination, if I decide to put myself at a health risk, then it's my choice. Alcohol and cigarettes are both legal in israel, 8000 people die every year in israel as a result of cigarettes which is already more than the deaths of covid19 in israel, which are around 6000. This isn't about safety, it's about control, and even if you believe it's about health safety, it's none of the governments' business, which again brings me back to alcohol and cigarettes to prove the pure hypocrisy. In case you say "actually, the virus is contagious so innocent people will be hurt", there are 2 flaws to that logic, firstly alcohol also causes deaths and injuries to innocent bystanders, and so does cigarettes, it causes second hand smoke deaths. Lastly, the second flaw, is that if you are so scared of getting infected by someone else, it's your own choice to stay at home, you should not rely on the action of others. So this argument is already completely debunked and there's no other argument that can be used.


Israel has a law that does force you to wear a mask, its not about "your choice", it falls under the law of public's health.
meaning anything that could harm the public's health is considered Illegal and you can be punished for it.
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Quote
section 19. In any city or village or area in which an infectious disease has acquired or is likely to take epidemic form or which is contagious or contagious in the opinion of the Director which endangers the public health of the mentioned town, village or area, the Director or Government Physician may take the corresponding measures If he deems it necessary to protect the inhabitants of these places from the infection, and for this purpose he may, among other things, impose on the residents of the aforesaid city, village or area the obligation of a protective wear or other assembly which he deems necessary to reduce the spread of infection. Anyone who knowingly refuses under this section to assemble or otherwise assemble against smallpox, cholera or anything, shall be guilty of an offense and shall be liable to a fine not exceeding five pounds (outdated price) or to imprisonment for not more than one month.


vaccination "green card" wasnt made to give those who are vaccinated a privilege, it was made so it actually to declare areas as "safe" and virus free.
meaning you cant get sick here, whats the point of going somewhere closed and sitting with out a mask around people who can infect you.

Now you can say, who ever wants to "take it on his own risk" - thats not possible, once you get infected, you infect other people, hence putting their health at risk, thus violating their human rights to health.
and as its known, Your freedom ends when you violate someone else's freedom.



P.S if you are gonna reply to me, please do it in a respectful manner otherwise I will not answer back, thanks in advance.
« Last Edit: 15 03, 2021, 09:46:38 pm by Norman »
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Offline OhhKarim

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #13 on: 15 03, 2021, 10:29:46 pm »
the problem with you is you are thinking about it as if the government made it and forces it

The government is in charge of supplying and incentivizing the masses, hence they are involved. Yes they are forcing it, if they say they will take certain rights of you if you do not abide by their words and vaccinate yourself, this means they are forcing you to take the vaccination, there's no way around it. If you say that you cannot participate in basic rights unless you vaccinate, then that is literally blackmailing your own people which is completely unethical.

yet you forget its our doctors and scientists that are among us who made these vaccines and they are the ones who recommend it.

Doctors also make other medicines and recommend them, doesn't mean I am forced to take anything from them. So why is that logic suddenly not applied to this vaccine?

just like if you got a problem with anything in your life, you got to an expert to find you a solution or a fix, and in this situation its those medical experts who came with a solution.

Again, they give solutions, it doesn't mean I am forced to take them. When I went to the doctor to do a blood test to check if I had lactose intolerance, they confirmed I had lactose intolerance and told me to avoid milk products. This is a recommendation/solution from the experts. Yet I am still consuming the milk products, I know the risks it gives me (stomach ache etc). It's only their duty to inform us and give their recommendation, not to force me to do anything. Same with the vaccination, they can recommend it all they want, forcing people to take it by taking away their rights if they do not follow this recommendation, is blackmail and unethical.

I dont think any of you is any smarter and more experienced than actual doctors and scientists who all their life revolves about things like this.
just like you trust your plumber to fix your broken sink and blocked drain, or your technician to fix your TV and Mobile phone, you should trust them.

There are millions of doctors, not all doctors have the same opinions, we are humans and we can have wrong opinions, even if they are highly educated. Cigarettes were suggested to be healthy for a long time. Doctors aren't a god.

Living in a 3rd world country that has one of the lowest healthcare system in the world that doesn't care about an on-going global pandemic isn't a thing to be proud of too...is it?

I have lived in both a 1st world and 3rd world country and life has been better in the 3rd world country in general. The only thing worse for me is the decreased job opportunities.

I do not say that what Israel is doing is right or wrong in its way of dealing with this spreading virus, but it is doing something about it atleast.

Doing something negative is worse than doing nothing, 2 wrongings is worse than 1 wronging.

It raced to be the first country with the most vaccination percent in the world and be "proof" that the world needs, Cause Israel actually believes in Technology and medicine.

Man that's nice and all, the issue is the forcing of vaccination by blackmailing people that do not take the vaccination, by threatening to take their basic rights.

Israel has a law that does force you to wear a mask, its not about "your choice", it falls under the law of public's health.
meaning anything that could harm the public's health is considered Illegal and you can be punished for it.

Again tell me, then why are alcohol and cigarettes allowed in israel? Cigarettes causes more than 8000 deaths per year in israel, which is already more than covid19 has done which are around 6000 deaths. Cigarettes cause second hand smoke deaths to innocent bystanders. Alcohol causes drunk drivers to kill innocent people too, and some effects on israeli people regarding alcohol use here: https://www.who.int/substance_abuse/publications/global_alcohol_report/profiles/isr.pdf?ua=1

vaccination "green card" wasnt made to give those who are vaccinated a privilege, it was made so it actually to declare areas as "safe" and virus free.
meaning you cant get sick here, whats the point of going somewhere closed and sitting with out a mask around people who can infect you.

Now you can say, who ever wants to "take it on his own risk" - thats not possible, once you get infected, you infect other people, hence putting their health at risk, thus violating their human rights to health.
and as its known, Your freedom ends when you violate someone else's freedom.

Again the infection hypocrisy. I already responded to that argument. Wearing a mask shouldn't be forced even if none took a vaccination, if I decide to put myself at a health risk, then it's my choice. Alcohol and cigarettes are both legal in israel, 8000 people die every year in israel as a result of cigarettes which is already more than the deaths of covid19 in israel, which are around 6000. This isn't about safety, it's about control, and even if you believe it's about health safety, it's none of the governments' business, which again brings me back to alcohol and cigarettes to prove the pure hypocrisy. In case you say "actually, the virus is contagious so innocent people will be hurt", there are 2 flaws to that logic, firstly alcohol also causes deaths and injuries to innocent bystanders, and so does cigarettes, it causes second hand smoke deaths. Lastly, the second flaw, is that if you are so scared of getting infected by someone else, it's your own choice to stay at home, you should not rely on the action of others.

If the vaccine works, why are you afraid of people that are infected by the virus? Aren't you already safe by the vaccine? Let them put theirself at their own risk, aren't you already safe with your vaccine? If not, then what's even the point of the vaccine?

Offline Norman

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Re: Vaccine passport
« Reply #14 on: 16 03, 2021, 01:30:39 am »
you are talking as an individual, yet vaccine is made for the whole public.
I took the vaccine and I'm not Afraid of the virus, neither was I before the vaccine, But just the thought of me being able to infect other people and causing loss of their life is what drove me into taking the vaccine, It might be a minor thing for me, but for example my mother is in the danger zone due to her age, I don't think you would love losing someone you love because you were selfish and being such an outlaw and not wanting do something because someone else decided it for you. You are not alone in this world, Thinking only about your-self is what you can call "unethical"

Cigarettes and alcohol are consumables that are known to cause diseases, it isnt recommended to consume them by anyone, even the governments oblige Tobacco companies to put warning signs to raise awareness, yet they dont ban them since its a major income and you cant stop people from consuming them anyway- this comparison is no where related to an actual biological virus to a thing that causes diseases in which you know you will eventually have if you continue doing what you are doing.
some unhealthy habits that you choose throughout your life can cause you these diseases, so its your mistake at last.

these days anything can kill you, your phone causes radiation, your food can poison you, over drinking water can poison you, car accidents can kill you.
does that mean we stop using them?

But I don't see anyone going out and saying "hey imma go out without a mask so I can get infected by the virus" --- no one chooses to get infected, hence the word 'infect'- affect (a person, organism, cell, etc.) with a disease-causing organism.

once you have an infectious deadly virus, you are considered as a "live biological weapon".



I see your point of view of the government's "taking your rights"- but once again, Your rights end when you violate other's.

If you would have read the law I stated in the spoiler(I highly suggest you to read it) you would have understood better why governments such as Israel's have resorted to such limitations and It is indeed the government's business, otherwise if the death tolls rise who you are gonna blame? aren't you gonna go and blame the government for not taking care of its people?

governments are the ones who bring order to this world, without them it would be a chaos (you might disagree on this too, but its true- applying to most of the governments of the world -- not all) 
I strongly disagree with you on this and I think you should rethink of how governments work and what they are there for..




« Last Edit: 16 03, 2021, 01:36:19 pm by Norman »
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