Development Changes

[Arran]

For almost 4 years now I've been scripting and scripting. Making the server better and better. Expecting the player count to rise and rise until it rose so much it lagged and lagged. But that never happened, we've not experienced lag in so long, because we're no where near the amount of players that we can handle. And anyone whose a regular can see that the player count isn't what it used to be.



As you can see we're almost 1000 unique players down from 2 years ago. So if the player count is now worse than 2 years ago all that scripting didn't really achieve anything. Which is why I have now closed the game reviews board and put it along with the old feature suggestion board as there is really no point in continuing a strategy that hasn't worked for 2 years.

So if I'm not going to be scripting, what will I be doing? For a start, I, we, need to figure out why people don't want to play. The problem with forum suggestions is that only people who stay made those topics, people who don't play obviously don't bother to register forum accounts.

I've already brought this up with the staff team and got a variety of limited theories. One of those theories was that there are many changes which ruined LV. I asked for a list of proposed changes that would make it how it used to be but didn't get one so now I'm going to ask you all. If the LV regulars can make a list of changes that many can agree to there is no reason why I won't make those changes.

The only 2 changes I won't do are: "Old Speed" the only reason why it didn't cause desync was because of a very inefficient hard coded 100ms pure sync interval which means your position desync was corrected 10 times a second but now to save lots of CPU and Bandwidth our pure sync interval ranges from 150ms to 400ms and with 400ms the desync would be bad. Also since everyone was using speed they didn't notice it because all their games were running at the faster speed. You can't make somebodies game faster than others and expect it to not cause problems. The second thing I won't do is reverting to the crappy old turf percentage system because I probably don't have it and it would take too much effort reverting to something that is clearly inferior.

LV is just one of many factors though, people have said they no longer play because of that so it's definitely one of the problems but there are many more issues than just LV. Another example of a theory I got was that some players can't take getting punished so if they get muted because they made a 'fail' they rage quit the server. So I made it impossible to fail by adding the '/main' command.

If you have a theory, any theory at all even if you don't think we'll agree to it, why not post it any way? You're not going to get punished for what you post here though if you are worried that might happen you can forum PM me your theory and I can decide on it myself or I'll post it in this topic for you so nobody will know who wrote it.

[Houaiss]

I love the server, but let me guess... stuff are way overpriced... in terms of vechiles, or... you work and work for hours and hours to receive a retard payment... that is the real problem.... that are making player forget the server... you know, I have in online games for a few years, and I never saw a game which we are farming all the time, games should be to enjoy, not to work! Work is for real life.... im not saying to stop this thing of making money with a few amount of jobs but to decrease the time we are on it... and enjoy more the server...

[ERBA]

problems for me are 3:
1) the percentage sistem of the turf isnt so funny
2) the prices of goods, the introduction of F7 and of the /craft
3) the zones that made the server lagg, people that doesn't have a very good pc can't enter in LS because is too big to charge...

this ruined the server I can say it because I started to play when there were the maximum amount of people playing and the server was completely different, in that time gaming was funny now not so much and for this people stopped playing or stopped to say friends that is an awesome game.

[Romeo:3!]

One of the problems IMO are the drugs, now are too expensive, It is impossible for some ppl to get drugs, and play whitout drug is too hard, in my opinion they should be more accessible.

And the CityZones isn't the problem, guys if you can't play for the zones, your pc is too bad.

[chimie]

I think your LV theory is right. The massive changes to the combat system made most of  the players who used to play the game then, to quit now. One of the things is that they got used to a gameplay which got completely changed. Lots of new weapons, lots of new strategies. Since they knew the old combat gameplay, when it got changed they just didn't find it fun anymore so they didn't want to waste their time learning new strategies. A thing I said in another topic is that back then player skill was needed. You could do a shitload of weapons combinations and win or lose. Now most of the players do the same : one shotgun bullet so he won't be able to run[anyone can hit one shotgun bullet] => run and hide after a wall and kill your opponent with the powerfull m4. The old weapons were cool.

I understand that the speed is not going to come back but that must be another reason, since a fast game will always get your blood pressure rising.


Every criminal will agree that back then that LV chaos was good, was fun. And fun is the thing that brings people here.

Another thing can be how some admins handle punishments. Like... they really need to punish a guy for misconducting for VIP spawing his Maverick and taking off from a not so used road? For example from the road at the small hospital near LV, where you spawn if you die in the south turfs. Taking off takes like 4 seconds. I say this based on what I see not because this happened to me.

[Uardo.]

Hey,
It's nice to see such a topic, where we can actually suggest something and we are not "afraid" of getting punished.


I am going to suggest few thing that I do believe that might improve LV somehow.

- Bring back griefing rule.
Some players in LV usually get on some unreachable roofs and start spamming grenades from there, I know that there is a turfing height limit  that doesn't allow them to turf but as long as the defenders leave the turf, these who are on the roof goes down to provoke it and than run again up on the unreachable roof it's so annoying for defenders. So what I believe that would solve this is removing the height turfing limit and bringing back griefing rule, it's simple like in old times, if the roof is unreachable, the player get punished, I know that this will bring more work for staff team because they will have to handle more complaints but players will not get "Pissed" anymore in LV.

-Lowering the projectile prices.
$3,000 for a projectile is a bit expensive in my opinion because to kill one player with 200 hp you need three grenades or satchels, three satchels costs $12,000 and normally to earn $12,000 they have to wait like 6-9 mins or even more, depends on how many turfs they own and how many member are online, so I believe that projectile are overpriced. $2,000 or $2,500 for a projectile would be ways better than it is actually.

-Binds
Binds are causing a tremendous ridiculous de-sync, players who use it slides all over the screen and it's almost impossible for the opponent to kill them, also I know that you added some improvements to binds but it still causes de-sync I can record a video for that. Also I know that there will come some that will say, if you can't kill bind users go out of LV or learn how to use binds too. Disabling binds completely would be better or if you can fix that de-sync. /discuss.

Turfing System
I know that you already wrote that you won't add old turfing system, I am not suggesting to bring it back, what I am saying is to add some improvements to the current one because if in one turf are more than 3 gangs fighting with each-other it is impossible for the turf to be provoked. For example in a turf are fighting two groups X and Y and a third Z group comes to help Y group, both Z and Y group spawn kill X but the turf wont be provoked, I have no idea why buy that's pretty annoying, the only solution for X group members is to log off, because none likes getting spawnkilled and further more it wont end because the turf isn't getting provoked. 
Actually I don't have any improvement in my mind about turfing system but I brought that point up because others might do.

Regards,
Uardo

[Tad]

I know you asked mostly about LV. But I just want to help with bringing back the old days (as I am from those days).

I think by telling what I miss will be like a answer to what this server has .

- The old marketing system.
Damn I miss that omg. Even now I remember that small spot near BR where everyone was selling their stuff. All were screaming  "My drugs are the cheapest / No mine are" etc. That brought a more realistic feel of gameplay. It doesn't even compare with the F7 thing. And /craft should be limited, like only being possible to craft some basic stuff.
- The weedfarm. That was the most epic way to get weed ever.
- Non-Donators could of owned more than 1 house.
- The damage that weapons had at those times.
- And my opinion is that a lot of  who were / or come to this server and find out the only place you can kill everything is in LV, that makes them not so interested. Only I know a handful of people that left because of the absence of DM. (People knew then that if you didn't wanted to be killed, just quit job and be a civilian or go off duty as a cop).


What can I say about a current disturbance that's rising, is that more and more people refuse or quite their criminal activities due to the fact that you can't even rob a store or a bank now days. There are too many cops. And the worst thing is, both sides have something to lose... Criminals stop being criminals and cops slowly won't have much work to do (i'm talking as in general, of course there are the criminals that will never stop being criminal). All this happened since this I believe:

Wednesday 17th September 2014
- Police: Added an arrest payment multiplier based on your arrest points. The message when you jail them will tell you how much your multiplier is. 10,000 arrest points is equal to a pay increase of 10%. Because some people have ridiculous arrest points and would earn 24 times more from jailing someone, the highest the multiplier will go is 3. (Arran)

A simple fix for this might be a similar system depending on the Reputation that the criminal has (in F5).

[Houaiss]

I see you are making updates while you are reading this coments arran, you are doing well! and yes like the coments above, make shotguns, and machine guns more useful on close ranges, instead of this rifle vs rifle 24/7!

[BClaude]

One of the theories I could put up, being an old member myself, is the fact drugs were less accessible. Years ago there was a drug factory in LS that people could make drugs for themselves, but it was closed forever because some people used bot-scripts. Nowadays if people want to make drugs easier, they need to donate, which to me, sounds like a microtransaction that I can't afford.

The community appears deteriorated. 3 years ago, while I was in gangs, the community was more understandable, people knew a word of English or two, and there was less begging and scammers in this server. I think it's because in this server, they care about money than building a community.

One thing I will say about some minor features, like crafting- who uses them? As a criminal, I don't even know why we have that anyways.

[MagicMayhem]

The majority left due to the updates, people enjoyed the old fighting system. One of the enjoyments of turfing was being able to wipe out larger groups with only 5-7 members online, now it's pretty much impossible(not to sure about this, haven't been playing for a while so this may have been changed.)

[SpongeFin]

- And my opinion is that a lot of people who were / or come to this server and find out the only place you can kill everything is in LV, that makes them not so interested. Only I know a handful of people that left because of the absence of DM. (People knew then that if you didn't wanted to be killed, just quit job and be a civilian or go off duty as a cop).

Im going to continue from that:

- Not being able to kill everyone you see. Even if it was against rules, the possibility of it made the gameplay have more depth. When teamkilling was removed it also removed the necessity of self-defence.
- Not being able to hijack player's vehicles
- Ghostmode

You took GTA out of GTA. What do you think the first thing players will try to do once they create their character and choose "criminal" starting point? They will empty their Tec9/Mac10(or whatever weapon it was that was given for free) clips on the nearest player which most of the times happens to be criminal or civilian. How many will actually want to stay after they find out they can't even manage to kill someone in GTA game?

[dominos]

Hello,
i will say somethings maybe it's caused of leaving people this server :
first something is Lv :
    now every one is bro by binds of guns and m4 and removing the RPGs it is effect too ,so each people left this server because this  updates or other and many groups get deleted by this updates too I think if bind get remove and the speed back to old time and grenades and satchel back to old system too it will caused in back some people to this server ,i think Lv without speed and RPG and spamming grenades anymore makes many people feel bored .
Second something is lower the payments of jobs :
     the last updates at jobs it's too caused of leaving people this server as I see like job iron miner now is nothing with new update ,and job fisherman nobody work at it as I saw everyday ,and job news reporter when get update can't get PIC at DS and PDR and ACA .
     Third something is disabled take drugs at criminal events it's too caused will some each people leave this server because this new update for example me i'm really feel bored from this update .
Finally:
    Arran I think if you still make new updates like remove drugs from criminal events and decrease the payments in jobs ,i think you are kicking the players from this server by indirectly ways .

[VDN]

One of the reasons why people go to LV and then complain about it is LS.

Since the multiplier update for cops they became extremely active, actually way too many cops. Usually newbies want to rob stores and banks etc, you'll get something like 2,5 - 10k while cops earn up to 20-100k with the new update, and how much do new criminals earn? 2,5k for robbing a store. They rather work as cops. Yesterday I heard cops complaining about having no wanted criminals in LS. I was robbing the warehouse with a couple of criminals here and within 1 minute more than 20 cops came.

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And this, what have been suggested a lot of times: bring ammu-nation back. Recently there is no way to get drugs aswell and without drugs you're a free kill.

[MadaFaka]

1. Medkits. They started to get ridiculously priced and inflated by as much as 100%. Then they got nerfed to the point where they are on the verge of pointless. They heal too slow and if you are defending alone vs cracks you have absolutely no chance. They should be made what they were before and at a cheaper price.

2. The price of grenades and satchels. $1000 is probably a bit cheap yes but $3000 is too expensive (this coming from someone who can afford them) - it stops "normal" players from having a level ground so I think $1500-2000 per grenade/satchel would be more reasonable.

3. Bring back weed having an effect on satchels. (making them go further)

4. Remove spawn protection in LV. Takes far too long now to stop a crack gang in a huge turf.

5. Be allowed to play and shoot as a civillian in LV. The days where players could help gangs without provoking their turf made it much more simple. (nobody can be assed taking a medic job then returning, that's just the way it is)

6. This whole "not allowed to type in LV when dead / not allowed to view messages in LV when dead / not allowed to use animations in LV" is completely ridiculous imo. The part of the fun with this server was the rivalry between gangs and the competitive nature, now it feels like we are in an episode of the power puff girls.

7. As previously stated, the old speed was probably a killer for a huge proportion of old players. It made the game fast-paced and prevented the slugish gameplay we have today - get shot with a shotgun to the point where you can't run, you can't heal because the medkits are too slow, boom, you are dead. I understand there was some desync problems but perhaps giving it another go to see how the playerbase reacts would be a step in the right direction.

8. The turf payments. I think that with LV being the main competive side to the game should give some serious rewards. Players spend hours trying to take a large proportion of turfs only for it to give a small return in terms of cash. Increasing the turf payments would entice a whole lot more players to LV and encourage players to actually fight for turfs opposed to giving up because there isn't much logic in wasting $100,000 in 30 minutes to fight then getting $30,000 an hour from turfs.

9. Dual weapons without restrictions. The days where people could run around with their dual sawn offs and not be restricted to a single motion was great. Again, it added variery to the game which I feel is important for a game like GTA: SA, let's be real, it's a 10 year old game which isn't gonna get any newer. Adding little things like above makes it far more interesting and fun to play.

10. Last but not least, the original weapon binds. We were all aware what the binds did (making the player move fast) but I honestly feel that it added a huge amount of character and variety to both individual players and server. You knew if you saw a guy in the distance who knew how to use binds it would be a challenge to fight against him, that is extremely rare these days as everyone now switches to their M4. I never understood the logic of players who complained about weapon binds. They could be easily learned by everyone, that's all it takes - some patience and learning.

Just my two cents...

[Gunner21]

You took GTA out of GTA. What do you think the first thing players will try to do once they create their character and choose "criminal" starting point? They will empty their Tec9/Mac10(or whatever weapon it was that was given for free) clips on the nearest player which most of the times happens to be criminal or civilian. How many will actually want to stay after they find out they can't even manage to kill someone in GTA game?

Then in that case, there is a rule needed to be come which was like 2 years back, punishing for DMing, most probably.


Ammo and Drugs - Crafting System :

These are the major necessities which needs to be open again. The prices are damn high for the new players, still people will somehow manage to buy little but still they are not high. Also about crafting system which I didn't understand all why there is a need to create ? You have said you we should create an economy ? new players are here to have little fun and enjoyment, working like these is sort of boredom to them, according to me. I'm sorry if you feel I violated your thoughts and updates. New players often search for enjoyment and fun, civilian job maybe a side-work.


CITy Zones :

Many of the players on server are happy with the CITy update and I guess it should be since, even new players to old players can buy them easily and can construct alone or with their friends with no loss/profit. I guess that should be there BUT there is need to remove these zones from many of the major areas where there is a lot of crowd, like the DS Area, near LS Airport, these are the few spots.


Regards