Author Topic: Does this board need rules?  (Read 710 times)

Offline Claire

  • Moderator
  • *****
  • La vie est belle
  • Registered: 15/07/2013
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Ingame: Claire
Does this board need rules?
« on: 13 11, 2018, 09:06:42 am »
So currently we have no rules being enforced for this board and I've got feedbacks from some people that we should have some to make things "better" or at least more organised.

Since the first time I moderate here, I've pretty much given total a liberty on almost everything. I didn't even delete copy-paste posts before many complaints and reports by other members about it. I like giving people freedom so that they don't have to worry about rules and limit to share whatever it is in their mind. I believe that people can just agree on what's right or wrong collectively without having to refer to something we call written "rules". And I feel that this board is the most honest in the whole forum because of that approach in some degrees.

But I ain't a dictator, of course. If other members think rules are needed, then maybe we should make some. Let's discuss.
Polymathic | I/O Psychologist | Techie | Painter | Writer | Bibliophile | Old Soul | #nerd

"Diversity is the one true thing we all have in common. Celebrate it every day."

Offline OhhKarim

  • Senior Community Member
  • ****
  • Players of the Gold
  • Registered: 16/05/2015
    YearsYearsYearsYears
  • Group: Team eXodus #1
  • Ingame: OhhKarim
  • Squad: NoAP4U
Re: Does this board need rules?
« Reply #1 on: 13 11, 2018, 11:34:01 am »
As long as you're respectfully debating, I don't see any necessity for other rules. However I do understand that blatant copying could be annoying, if you want to keep that rule as well then I'm fine with it.

Offline Sevec

  • Senior Community Member
  • ****
  • Pessimistic
  • Registered: 24/06/2017
    YearsYears
  • Group: BNA
  • Ingame: Sevec
  • Squad: Wrath
Re: Does this board need rules?
« Reply #2 on: 13 11, 2018, 07:43:22 pm »
Make a rule for people who are farming posts, basically people who say one sentence in their topic.

Topic Title: Is Trump bad?
Topic Content: Guys is Trump bad? I want to know your opinions about this.
If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention.

Offline Arran

  • Administrator
  • ******
  • Registered: 20/11/2010
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Ingame: [CIT]Arran
Re: Does this board need rules?
« Reply #3 on: 13 11, 2018, 10:24:25 pm »
Well other than the useless post rule which is already applied as it applies to the whole forum except player ran boards (groups and such) what rules would it need? I already punish every now and then for a blatant useless post. And as a moderator all you can do is remove posts which break any rules / you deem unproductive, it's not like anyone can get muted.

Offline Claire

  • Moderator
  • *****
  • La vie est belle
  • Registered: 15/07/2013
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Ingame: Claire
Re: Does this board need rules?
« Reply #4 on: 14 11, 2018, 02:09:57 am »
I didn't mean rules for punishment (there are many scientific evidences that show that punishing is not really an effective behaviour conditioning approach. So I don't care about that). I meant rules telling what kind of post worth moderating. For instance, I've got feedbacks (via PM) that sometimes people get too emotional in replies and their posts should get deleted, or when people get too much off-topic, or as Sevec has pointed above.
Polymathic | I/O Psychologist | Techie | Painter | Writer | Bibliophile | Old Soul | #nerd

"Diversity is the one true thing we all have in common. Celebrate it every day."

Offline Sevec

  • Senior Community Member
  • ****
  • Pessimistic
  • Registered: 24/06/2017
    YearsYears
  • Group: BNA
  • Ingame: Sevec
  • Squad: Wrath
Re: Does this board need rules?
« Reply #5 on: 14 11, 2018, 05:53:37 am »
Or posts like this.

Because CR7 is better than Messi
If you think this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention.

Offline Dimit

  • USNS Leader
  • Moderator
  • ****
  • USHITTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
  • Registered: 09/10/2012
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Group: U.S.Navy SEALs
  • Ingame: ADM-Dimit#USNS
Re: Does this board need rules?
« Reply #6 on: 26 11, 2018, 03:29:40 pm »
well its not an easy problem to solve
too many rules and guidelines might negatively affect the board activity
on the other hand its extremely annoying to see people answering on debates as if its a voting topic, not in any way debating with the topic starter or the previous posts but just leaving the personal opinion there in 1 line and moving to the next topic
Its very rare that some people actually have a big heated discussion with lots of arguments, quotes and sources, and it really demotivates those kind of people if the next reply they see on the debate is a random post without value that ignores everything that has been stated in previous post and comes up with the same idiotic assumptions and claims again that have been proven wrong before
Its not that simple to force people to post "non-idiotic stuff" with written rules, and while seeing that a considerable percentage of the board users seem to lack the capabilities to do so, its probably something that you might not want to try and fight too much with force.
(Edit: it would make sense to require people to post a paragraph always because every single 1 line post on this board without exception is pretty useless)
It would be better if Community rank managers would have a closer look at the post quality of the people that apply for these ranks, that would take lots of motivation to spam posts without value here only to appear active.

In fact, the most cancerous problem on the debate board is the huge amount of post farming with plagiarized posts from google, which is almost the only thing I use the delete button for.
On some days I delete dozens of posts on this board of people which copy the headline of the debates, google them, copy&paste one paragraph of the first result they get and do that on every open debate so that they can apply for a community position a few days later. (post farming)
It goes as far as having people copying text from the same sites, like debate.org, some people even copy from other players previous posts in this debate, and some people even forgot that they have already post-farmed in this debate and just do it again the next day.

I'm also not in any way supporting the idea of implementing restrictions regarding political and religious debates, the whole idea of this board (and I assume the reason of it being created in the first place) was to be able to discuss and debate all the heated stuff that we want to keep out of any other boards on this forum, and I am really sceptical about Arrans decision to lock the "beyong_terrorism" topic in which people have provided valid arguments for how the quran is a foundation for such a huge amount of hate and violence in this world and the debate had once again to be locked(which is nothing else but the surrender under religious censorship which is very common nowdays in western country societies that don't really know how to deal with non-liberal ideologies) only because the people always fail to control their emotions in religious debates.
It was already in summer of 2018 in a previous burqa-related debate topic where a dutch player claimed at some point of his post that islam is the "religion of hate"(which is a legitimate personal standpoint) and an islamic L5 staff actually came out of nowhere and posted on that debate to "not accuse any religion of anything again" and that its not allowed and so on, implying that some special blasphemy laws would apply to this board.
Meanwhile simultaneously there was a topic about gay marriage open in which religious people were posting basically every 30 minutes what a "disease homosexuality is" and how much of a "crime" it is and so on, which was open for full 20 pages without censorship and almost zero board cleaning, and that same staff interestingly didnt post there, in fact that staff (i guess) never posted on this board at all.
If we want to have an have an isolated debate board which is for the more critical topics then it must be ensured that people can actually debate them without following religious laws, just like we were very tolerant on 20 pages of homophobic posts on the gay marriage debate because thats simply the personal viewpoint of many people, and everyone who is too sensitive for these debates is free to not use this board (=original idea of the seperated debate board)
Because otherwise we could just move all these "do you believe in ghosts" and "is technology good or bad" topics to the general chat board and dont need to have an private board for this.
« Last Edit: 26 11, 2018, 03:44:13 pm by Dimit »
There's no god, no saviour, no paradise and no life beyond. Our existence is limited. Nothing will save us from death.  Use your time on earth wisely.
Be kind to others, share your wealth - donate to the poor, protect the environment, use your opportunity every day to make earth a better place.
Currently 795 million humans have insufficent access to food.
You can start helping today



Online Nikos

  • The Helper
  • Community Developer
  • *****
  • Perfected noob
  • Registered: 03/02/2015
    YearsYearsYearsYears
  • Group: Bikers
  • Ingame: Nikos
  • Squad: Ns
Re: Does this board need rules?
« Reply #7 on: 26 11, 2018, 03:45:53 pm »
I'm also not in any way supporting the idea of implementing restrictions regarding political and religious debates, the whole idea of this board (and I assume the reason of it being created in the first place) was to be able to discuss and debate all the heated stuff that we want to keep out of any other boards on this forum, and I am really sceptical about Arrans decision to lock the "beyong_terrorism" topic in which people have provided valid arguments for how the quran is a foundation for such a huge amount of hate and violence in this world and the debate had once again to be locked(which is nothing else but the surrender under religious censorship which is very common nowdays in western country societies that don't really know how to deal with non-liberal ideologies) only because the people always fail to control their emotions in religious debates.
It was already in summer of 2018 in a previous burqa-related debate topic where a dutch player claimed at some point of his post that islam is the "religion of hate"(which is a legitimate personal standpoint) and an islamic L5 staff actually came out of nowhere and posted on that debate to "not accuse any religion of anything again" and that its not allowed and so on, implying that some special blasphemy laws would apply to this board.
Meanwhile simultaneously there was a topic about gay marriage open in which religious people were posting basically every 30 minutes what a "disease homosexuality is" and how much of a "crime" it is and so on, which was open for full 20 pages without censorship and almost zero board cleaning, and that same staff interestingly didnt post there, in fact that staff (i guess) never posted on this board at all.
If we want to have an have an isolated debate board which is for the more critical topics then it must be ensured that people can actually debate them without following religious laws, just like we were very tolerant on 20 pages of homophobic posts on the gay marriage debate because thats simply the personal viewpoint of many people, and everyone who is too sensitive for these debates is free to not use this board (=original idea of the seperated debate board)
Because otherwise we could just move all these "do you believe in ghosts" and "is technology good or bad" topics to the general chat board and dont need to have an private board for this.
This is absolutely right. Censoring opinions based on facts and sources just because people might get offended is wrong. As far as you are free to call homosexuality a disease by using an ancient book as an argument then you are free to judge this ancient book for stating some non-sense things for the current century. Since when debates are made to randomly stating unfounded opinions based on personal beliefs?
Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex… It takes a touch of genius – and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction. - Albert Einstein

Offline OhhKarim

  • Senior Community Member
  • ****
  • Players of the Gold
  • Registered: 16/05/2015
    YearsYearsYearsYears
  • Group: Team eXodus #1
  • Ingame: OhhKarim
  • Squad: NoAP4U
Re: Does this board need rules?
« Reply #8 on: 26 11, 2018, 04:15:37 pm »
a dutch player claimed at some point of his post that islam is the "religion of hate"(which is a legitimate personal standpoint) and an islamic L5 staff actually came out of nowhere and posted on that debate to "not accuse any religion of anything again" and that its not allowed and so on, implying that some special blasphemy laws would apply to this board.
Meanwhile simultaneously there was a topic about gay marriage open in which religious people were posting basically every 30 minutes what a "disease homosexuality is" and how much of a "crime" it is and so on, which was open for full 20 pages without censorship and almost zero board cleaning, and that same staff interestingly didnt post there, in fact that staff (i guess) never posted on this board at all. If we want to have an have an isolated debate board which is for the more critical topics then it must be ensured that people can actually debate them without following religious laws, just like we were very tolerant on 20 pages of homophobic posts on the gay marriage debate because thats simply the personal viewpoint of many people, and everyone who is too sensitive for these debates is free to not use this board (=original idea of the seperated debate board)
Because otherwise we could just move all these "do you believe in ghosts" and "is technology good or bad" topics to the general chat board and dont need to have an private board for this.
So why is it fine if someone wants to claim Islam is a religion of hate, but not if someone personally thinks homosexuality is a disease? The reason the debate had 20+ pages is because not only Islamic people are against homosexuality, people from many religions (and even Atheists can be) meanwhile less people are against Islam. Next point, you said people allowed homophobic posts, well if they stated their opinion somewhat respectfully it didn't get removed, I know for a fact some people got warned, and afaik someone even tried to appeal. Also I don't know why you're so against "homophobic" responses, but not "Islamophobic" responses.

You're acting as if it's not fine to have an opinion against homosexuality, but it's fine to have an opinion towards Islam. Sounds biased to me, either both or none should be alright.

Offline Shehabos

  • Honorable
  • *****
  • Registered: 14/12/2012
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Group: SAPD
Re: Does this board need rules?
« Reply #9 on: 26 11, 2018, 05:46:08 pm »
Topic title: Does this board need rules?




Posts: A discussion about Islam religion...

Offline MeD.

  • 5th Leader
  • Junior Community Member
  • **
  • Registered: 12/11/2013
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYears
Re: Does this board need rules?
« Reply #10 on: 26 11, 2018, 10:23:07 pm »
Yeah it does, I've been noticing some people shit posting lately just to get that xCM..
Group Level Manager

Offline Dimit

  • USNS Leader
  • Moderator
  • ****
  • USHITTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
  • Registered: 09/10/2012
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Group: U.S.Navy SEALs
  • Ingame: ADM-Dimit#USNS
Re: Does this board need rules?
« Reply #11 on: 26 11, 2018, 10:40:13 pm »
Topic title: Does this board need rules?




Posts: A discussion about Islam religion...
ikr


All offf-topic posts are dumped here
Show content
Because you can prove that Islam is a religion of hate as well as that homosexuality isn't a disease. Here are my sources to prove that Islam spreads hate;
http://www.pewforum.org/files/2013/04/worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-full-report.pdf
http://www.pewglobal.org/2014/07/01/concerns-about-islamic-extremism-on-the-rise-in-middle-east/
http://www.pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the-world-divided-on-hamas-and-hezbollah/
http://www.realcourage.org/2009/08/pakistan-78-percent-call-for-apostate-deaths/
http://www.pewforum.org/files/2013/04/worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-full-report.pdf
https://www.worthynews.com/13119-pregnant-sudanese-christian-sentenced-to-hang
https://www.e-ir.info/2012/12/14/lgbt-rights-in-turkey-the-long-road-to-tolerance/#_edn2
http://www.pewforum.org/files/2013/04/worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-full-report.pdf
https://www.wsj.com/articles/a-reformation-for-islam-1426859626
https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2016/01/20/after-an-influx-of-violence-in-refugee-centres-the-city-of-berlin-plans-for-a-seperate-home-for-homosexual-and-transsexual-refugees/
https://data2.unhcr.org/en/situations/mediterranean
https://www.news.com.au/finance/econom
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/755/turning-a-blind-eye-to-hamas-atrocities
https://muslimstatistics.wordpress.co/
http://www.euro-islam.info/country-profiles/
https://themuslimissue.wordpress.com/

You may check all of them, they amount of people participated in the most of the resources as well as the sample of the people who participated.

And here are the scientific researches about homosexuality which prove that it isn't a disease neither choice.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/5ig14dyx1mt3cur/Human%20Sexual%20Orientation.pdf?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/57on04m4cn6mm5a/A%20linkage%20between%20dna%20markers%20on%20the%20X%20chromosome%20and%20male%20sexual%20orientation.pdf?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/scrm98sqwnfqe03/Linkage%20between%20sexual%20orientation%20and%20chromosome%20Xq28%20in%20males%20but%20not%20in%20females.pdf?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/uwtsdm9atz60jvy/Genome-wide%20scan%20demonstrates%20significant%20linkage%20for%20male%20sexual%20orientation.pdf?dl=0
http://www.cell.com/cell/pdf/S0092-8674(14)00286-4.pdf
https://www.dropbox.com/s/chqt1g4wom2p2ub/Germline%20DNA%20Demethylation%20Dynamics%20and%20Imprint%20Erasure%20Through%205-Hydroxymethylcytosine.pdf?dl=0

So you understand?

Show content

Show content
It's not a disorder.

The research had a sample size of 90 people...... all of them point to the same research, and I really don't think that is credible enough with that amount of sample size. Sure, there are differences - but they are not disorders. There is no evidence supporting it is a disorder directly from the brain, and again, sample size of 90 PEOPLE out of the millions of billions, is not credible enough.

It's not as debatable.

Why we would debate "Islam is a religion of hate" is because there is evidence supporting both of the sides - facts/opinions for both to give. Unless you provide me a credible research which actually says that LGBTQ+ are a DISEASE, at this point.


Show content
And seems like this question is about to turn into a debate of "Is islam spreads hate" .. I can confirm that it isn't.

Look, I'll give you an example,
Is any of you into Martial Arts? ? ..

If Yes. then you should know Taekwondo.

Tae Kwon Do are three words. literally means The Way Of Striking With Foot and Fist (afaik)

Taekwondo has two spread official sides.

ITF (International Taekwondo Federation) and WTF (World Taekwondo Federation)

So .. The ITF is the traditional Taekwondo, The real Martial art that involves a way to defend yourself. and use of fists and foot & some elbows.

And .. The WTF is more like an Olympic Sport that only use Kicks and never uses their fists

So .. kicking only in self-defense situations will get you killed undoubtly because your leg can easily be grabbed and you'll go off-balance.

Therefore.. People are hating on Taekwondo saying its the worst Martial Art and more like a Daycare for Kids at their Dojo. Judging it upon the WTF Taekwondo (The Olympic Sport)

Meanwhile.. The REAL Taekwondo is the ITF Taekwondo, and its more than helpful in a street fight as you'll surely win for the way it teaches you how to use your fists and foot in a fight and some deadly points you can aim for in a dangerous fight that might get you killed..


All of this was an example. Now let me tell you how is this example will make you understand that Muslims are 2 sides.

The Normal Muslim people : The Ones that prays 5 times a day, Fast at Ramadan. even Quraan, Our holy book is telling us to respect other religions
This is a verse from our holy book, Quraan, Which reveals that we should respect the other religions, How could we spread hate if Allah himself is ordering us to respect and love the other religions?
Normal Muslims are also the ones that gives poor people near the mosques money to help them to eat food. and the ones that visits Mekka whenever they can to visit the holy house (El-Ka'eba) so their wrongs can be cleared. and they live their life normally. I mean they play games, they have friends, they wear normal clothes, Even stylish clothes and they do some hairstyles too. (As some people thinks muslims are only people with big turban & Deshdasha or whatever its called) they have fun too. Just like anyone else.

The Wrong-Doers A.K.A ISIS/Terrorists : So .. ISIS and Terrorists are violating the world in the name of Islam, I don't really know whats their point of doing that, But they keep doing wrong things I believe they aren't even Muslim people because I've already stated about that our holy book, Quraan is telling us to respect other religions. Terrorists are destroying places & thinking this is how they will spread the Islam in the world. Wrong! .. this is not how it should be.

Tae Kwon Do means The way of striking with FIST and foot.
But people thinks Taekwondo is only Kicking martial art (judging it upon what they see on the TV "Olympics"
People thinks Islam spreads hate. Its called Islam. Islam literally in Arabic means "Peace" so how could Islam spread hate in the world? .. Just upon what they see  on the TV .. about that terrorists


And this is why I brought to you that example above. about Taekwondo.

People are judging too quickly upon the thing they see the most, WTF Taekwondo is being viewed at the TV because its an olympic sport. Meanwhile ITF Taekwondo is just being practiced in the Dojang without sharing it on the TV.

And there ISIS / Terrorists are destroying lands and they're being recorded in the TV in the name of Islam.
Meanwhile we Normal Muslims are just living our life normally, Just like YOU guys do, But no one notices as we can't record each-of-us life to share it with the world.

And because WTF Taekwondo is being viewed in the TV and everyone sees it they just judged the whole Martial Art as a bad Martial Art that might get you killed in a street fight. meanwhile the traditional and the real Martial Art is ITF Taekwondo (Which is good Martial Art)

And because Terrorists and ISIS are being viewed in the TV and everyone sees the crimes they're doing, They judged the whole religion as its a religion that spreads hate on the world and killing innocent people.. wrong .. Meanwhile the real people. Are the normal Muslim people. The people who lives a life that is similar to yours, We enjoy our time we have friends that we chat about, We make jokes we love and we hate we're humans, But people are just focusing on whats being showed the whole time in the TV .. this is why I brought you the Taekwondo example, Hope you understand this point kindly.



I hope you understand my example, I tried to kindly correct your point as I can see Nikos & Dimit you guys see Islam from the wrong point, I'm not here to send you an invitation to join the religion, I'm just correcting your point so you can understand that Islam has never spread hate around the world.

Love everyone,
Thanks :)


Show content
#1:
Disorder:
disrupt the systematic functioning or neat arrangement of.

If 90% (not sure about the exact percentage, but its the majority) of all people are straight, and it probably has been since the beginning of mankind (otherwise we'd already be extinct, right?), then doesn't that mean homosexuality is a disruption of the systematic functioning? A.k.a, the meaning of a disorder?

#2:
Disease:
a disorder of structure or function in a human, animal, or plant, especially one that produces specific symptoms or that affects a specific location and is not simply a direct result of physical injury.

Homosexuality isn't a result of a physical injury and applies to the definition of a disorder in a human, therefore it qualifies to the meaning of a disease.

#3:
Mental disorder:
A mental disorder, also called a mental illness or psychiatric disorder, is a behavioral or mental pattern that causes significant distress or impairment of personal functioning. ... Mental disorders are usually defined by a combination of how a person behaves, feels, perceives, or thinks.

They have different feelings towards the opposite sex compared to straight people, and that also means they think different. Also qualifies to the same definition.And therefore it's debatable, however I only took the first couple links that showed up, there's probably more tests done to confirm it. Google it if you're interested.According to the definition of a mental disorder, you are wrong as shown above.Repeating your own point which I already responded to.

I just want to clarify that I have nothing against gays, if you're one of them then I don't have any problems. Just don't be close-minded and say that's it's not debatable to say it could be a disease, and that it's automatically homophobic. I don't bash you for judging Islam either, we all have freedom of speech so don't be afraid to speak what comes to your mind. Just because it's against me doesn't mean I'm against saying what you want to say, so hopefully you do too. After all, it's a called a debate for a reason, am I right?

There's no god, no saviour, no paradise and no life beyond. Our existence is limited. Nothing will save us from death.  Use your time on earth wisely.
Be kind to others, share your wealth - donate to the poor, protect the environment, use your opportunity every day to make earth a better place.
Currently 795 million humans have insufficent access to food.
You can start helping today