Author Topic: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?  (Read 1046 times)

Offline OhhKarim

  • Senior Community Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2291
  • Players of the Gold
  • Registered: 16/05/2015
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Group: Team eXodus #1
  • Ingame: OhhKarim
  • Squad: NoAP4U
Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« on: 09 02, 2021, 10:08:50 am »
Everywhere around the world, there is an inequality between wealth distributions, in some areas more severely than in other areas. Some kids around the world go days without eating a single slice of bread, and at another part of the world there's several people who have more money than they could ever finish in their life time, if they decided to use 1 dollar every second of their life. Do you believe it is unethical to be a billionaire? What about being a millionaire, is that unethical too? At what point does the amount of wealth you possess, start becoming unethical - if at all? Share your views!

Offline Arran

  • Administrator
  • ******
  • Posts: 3307
  • Registered: 20/11/2010
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Ingame: [CIT]Arran
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #1 on: 09 02, 2021, 10:55:49 am »
A lot of billionaires, like Elon Musk who recently became the known richest or one of the richest persons don't actually have as much as they're said to have because their value is from the stocks they own which they couldn't possibly sell all of them without causing a crash in the value of the stocks. Well he must have billions available because he's running a $100 million prize right now to do with carbon capture technology but is also trying to prevent humanity going extinct by getting some of us living on another planet and the only reason why he's got so rich is because he actually started an ethical business (Tesla (making electric cars, rechargeable batteries, solar panels, etc)) which is trying to reduce environmental destruction and their driverless cars will save so many lives. And committed to giving away at least half their wealth.

Jeff Bezos though who was richest person for a long time:

Additionally, Bezos had never appeared on the annual list of America's 50 largest donors until 2018, when he took the top spot with the launch of a $2 billion fund for education programs for the homeless. That donation represented about 1.3% of his net worth at the time, Quartz reported.

I recall an article about him which said his total donations was like 0.1% of his net worth which just shows what a greedy bastard he must be. Amazon employees working like slaves, being so overworked they couldn't even stop for a toilet break, having to urinate in bottles, while working for the richest person alive... Now that's a greedy fucking bastard which is certainly an unethical billionaire.
Proof You Are so Much More Than What You Realise
Authority is not truth. Truth is authority.

Offline Floki

  • **
  • Posts: 54
  • Registered: 16/11/2014
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #2 on: 09 02, 2021, 11:45:53 am »
According to Forbes, as of March 18, 2020 there were 2,095 billionaires worldwide.

Imagine this many people donating 1% of their money, just 1% could change the sad lives of many unborn babies. the thing is there's enough money around the world to take care of everyone yet nobody cares.

No, its not unethical to be a billionaire, it only becomes unethical when u're doing nothing with it, not even trying you know. noone expects you to spend all ur money which u worked hard for but once you reach that limit your conscience has to help you realize what has to be done.  the only major donation we've seen from jeff bezos is his earth fund and he donated 10 billion dollars there. thats pretty cool but not as good as buying someone a slice of bread as karim said.

Offline DeathWish

  • Regular Community Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1058
  • All limitations are self-imposed.
  • Registered: 19/08/2014
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Group: Ineffables
  • Ingame: DeathWish
  • Squad: Cupcakes
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #3 on: 09 02, 2021, 12:45:01 pm »
No?

those people worked hard for their money most of them started with nothing and built empires they don't owe anything to anyone, they have no obligation to donate a single dime to anything but they are doing it out of their goodwill. Imagine making 100 dollars and you donate 1 dollar and then someone comes and says oh no look at this guy he donated only 1% of his money what an asshole while in reality you don't have to do any of that shit

Just because someone is successful doesn't mean he MUST give away half of his fortune to the poor, yes I agree you can't spend this much money but why should I give away money I WORKED FOR? did anyone give Jeff Bezos money when he was poor af ? no

Offline Prof.Gang

  • ChaosGuardians Founder
  • Senior Community Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 956
  • P G
  • Registered: 27/04/2017
    YearsYearsYears
  • Group: ChaosGuardians
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #4 on: 09 02, 2021, 02:20:47 pm »
There’s a possibility, yet these individual cases became billionaires only a small portion, and some of them started from the zero, mostly all of them are businessmen and politicians, they were born into a wealthy family which from the beginning of the century was dedicated to be millionaires, so you wouldn't know the difference between both types if they sat on rich face or zero.

It is common and natural for an individual to make an effort so that they can make money, and the more money they will make, the more steps and advice they will offer and upgrade as a human being to be qualified to be favored until they become a millionaire and then a billionaire. How to manage money and to grow it, it is easy to make money but difficult to keep and investe in the economic and social development.

After all, it’s their effort, their strategies, their focus, their perseverance, surely they deserve what they have achieved.

Offline domi

  • New Community Member
  • *
  • Posts: 188
  • Chilling somewhere in Europe
  • Registered: 21/01/2012
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #5 on: 09 02, 2021, 03:28:45 pm »
There are different kinds of billionaires.

First there are market billionaires. These people  offer you their product or service, and you have the right to choose whether you want it or not.

This is entirely voluntary and there's nothing wrong if people get rich off it.  Customers are better off because otherwise they wouldn't be parting with their hard-earned money.

These billionaires don't  have any obligation to “give back” to society. Society already benefits handsomely from their innovative products and services – or they wouldn't be rich in the first place. However, they should pay fair taxes as long as the rest of us are doing so.

Examples of market billionaires include Steve Jobs, Sam Walton,  John D. Rockefeller and many others

But then there are political billionaires like some of the Russian oligarchs, military-industrial complex in the US, and communist leaders like Fidel Castro, who basically died as billionaires as they impoverished their nations with left-wing policies.
« Last Edit: 10 02, 2021, 03:36:28 am by domi »
Peace

Offline Arran

  • Administrator
  • ******
  • Posts: 3307
  • Registered: 20/11/2010
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Ingame: [CIT]Arran
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #6 on: 09 02, 2021, 05:36:51 pm »
But then there are political billionaires.

Glad you mentioned this, this is actually why I said "the known richest" as I recall seeing an article which IIRC was from a debate topic here that showed that there are secret billionaires like Vladimir Putin and Kim Jong Un. These are the real unethical billionaires. Gotta feel sorry for them though because imagine being so mentally ill you have to steal billions of dollars and keep stealing even more billions because you can never feel any satisfaction and not even do anything with the money they stole, they should spend some of that money on some psychiatrists.
Proof You Are so Much More Than What You Realise
Authority is not truth. Truth is authority.

Offline domi

  • New Community Member
  • *
  • Posts: 188
  • Chilling somewhere in Europe
  • Registered: 21/01/2012
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #7 on: 09 02, 2021, 07:01:10 pm »
It's hard to justify when any government official gets rich from corruption money.

Corruption hits hard lower and middle classes in the developing world, who can't afford to pay bribes but want to improve their livelihoods by starting micro businesses.
« Last Edit: 10 02, 2021, 05:12:45 am by domi »
Peace

Offline OhhKarim

  • Senior Community Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2291
  • Players of the Gold
  • Registered: 16/05/2015
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Group: Team eXodus #1
  • Ingame: OhhKarim
  • Squad: NoAP4U
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #8 on: 13 02, 2021, 08:43:50 am »
There are billionaires who got their money through illegal means, and there are those who got it via legal means. Just because it's legal doesn't mean it's ethical. All they want to do is milk you as much as they can, they do not care if you enjoy their products, not to mention that their products are mostly used by the middle class, not by poor people. So how did they even help poor people? I never said anyone should be forced to donate, I am just saying that if you have so much money, too much money in fact, is it unethical to keep all of it knowing what happens to people around the world? In case someone says "then why don't you donate?", I actually do. But I'm not a billionaire, neither a millionaire, in order to give huge sums of money in order to create a big difference on earth. I'm sure every billionaire has the opportunity to create and fund one hospital that would operate without asking money from people (there are people who are physically hurt who just cannot pay to receive medical aid), or even a food bank, or buy one large building and allow homeless people to rest there over-night for free. I do realize that their networth is not the true amount of money they physically own, but I am sure that from the top billionaires, several ones do legit have more than a billion dollars ready to be spent. It's not even a dent in their pockets. I do not believe it is ethical to own that much money.

Offline Arran

  • Administrator
  • ******
  • Posts: 3307
  • Registered: 20/11/2010
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Ingame: [CIT]Arran
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #9 on: 13 02, 2021, 11:45:01 am »
What about a government too then? Perfect example is the US, which if they saved 1 week of their military expenditure, could end world hunger

"Oh but it's not our job to end world hunger" - But it's your job to go murder millions of civilians in the middle east? :fp:

And actually ending world hunger would be more beneficial to the US than their bloated military (it's so bloated to make the military industrial complex rich) because many conflicts are triggered by things like starvation because people are desperate and have nothing to lose and it would massively boost their reputation which would mean more support from other nations if ever attacked and who'd want to attack a kind country? So yeah basically the whole world could be so much better if the world wasn't controlled by the deep state and incompetents who control all big governments.
Proof You Are so Much More Than What You Realise
Authority is not truth. Truth is authority.

Offline OhhKarim

  • Senior Community Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2291
  • Players of the Gold
  • Registered: 16/05/2015
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Group: Team eXodus #1
  • Ingame: OhhKarim
  • Squad: NoAP4U
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #10 on: 13 02, 2021, 02:11:25 pm »
That's also true indeed, but it does not exclude the other idea.

Offline Nyle

  • FightForHonor Leader
  • Junior Community Member
  • **
  • Posts: 2730
  • Registered: 31/10/2018
    YearsYears
  • Group: FightForHonor
  • Ingame: [FFH]Nyle
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #11 on: 13 02, 2021, 06:41:09 pm »
This is a really important issue you are talking about.
We witness this situation from many countries of the world, especially in countries with strong economies.
Some people have very good incomes and they lead a very high quality life, but unfortunately, on the other hand, there are poor people who try to survive without even eating a loaf of bread a day.
We have to get in the habit of sharing and helping so as not to experience worse than this.
>:D

Offline domi

  • New Community Member
  • *
  • Posts: 188
  • Chilling somewhere in Europe
  • Registered: 21/01/2012
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #12 on: 14 02, 2021, 07:00:53 am »
Let me play the "devil's advocate" here.

Suppose there's a billionaire that's worth 50 billion. He may be a flawed person like the rest of us, he may have made mistakes, but his fortune has been made on the marketplace, by selling successful products to customers who keep buying from him.

We need to be honest. Obviously the customers like and benefit from the products or they wouldn't be buying in such quantities and our guy wouldn't be a billionaire.

But let's say the world now decides to take all of his wealth to give it to the poor. As a result, let's say 3 billion people get to share his wealth of 50 billion . 50 billion / 3 billion = 16 bucks for each person.

Now I don't know about you, but I think giving someone $16 isn't going to break his cycle of poverty. Some people may use the money for short-term food consumption, and that's OK, yet others may spend it on cigarettes and beer, which is not a great investment.

Other effects of this forceful redistribution of the billionaire's wealth don't look too promising. He will probably never run a business again, his company will cease to exist, many people will lose jobs and his beneficial products will never be sold again.

If we want to help the poor, we need to give them jobs, not short-term food consumption.

And the best way to create jobs is to let the market work. Governments need to let people start their micro enterprises without burdening them with expensive taxes and regulations. And when these micro enterprises start getting successful, they should be able to hire MORE people without having to figure out many regulations and without spending money on additional taxes / what have you. These things just keep people out of getting jobs and exploring new opportunities.

The solution is not to take money from some billionaire who gives us useful products. That's a short-term solution and it's not very effective for ultimately destroying poverty. Rather, the solution is to create new opportunities for poor people through entrepreneurship.
Peace

Offline OhhKarim

  • Senior Community Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2291
  • Players of the Gold
  • Registered: 16/05/2015
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Group: Team eXodus #1
  • Ingame: OhhKarim
  • Squad: NoAP4U
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #13 on: 14 02, 2021, 09:44:35 am »
I didn't say anywhere that they didn't earn that money, I even mentioned that of course certain billionaires did indeed earn their money via legal means. But you keep talking about appreciating them, when they shouldn't be appreciated. Oh you're appreciating that Apple sells people overpriced devices, as well as many other big companies do? You do realize that many companies would even keep the prices at an even higher price if there weren't any competitors? They don't give a fuck if you enjoy their products or not, they see you as a money making device, they are trying to "seduce" you (not literally hah) into buying their items, that's it. That's your only purpose to them.

That's also why they pay low wages to people, to maximize their profits, they don't care if their low waged workers do not earn enough revenue to eat 3 meals a day, or if they have to work 2 jobs. The workers are slaves for them, and the people are money making devices. This can be proven even further considering many big companies are starting to use robots, which makes people lose jobs. So while your argument that those companies offer jobs, is certainly true and that should be appreciated, there are way more things not to be appreciated for them. Soon in the near future many people will lose jobs as those companies decide to go automatized, they won't give a shit that many of their workers will lose their jobs. Amazon has 200,000 robots in their warehouse. The rise of robots and automation is projected to lead to the displacement of 20 million manufacturing jobs by 2030. A report from Oxford Economics estimates that about 8.5% of the global manufacturing workforce stands to be replaced by robots, with about 14 million manufacturing jobs lost in China alone.

Neither did I say, lets divide their whole wealth and distribute it equally amongst all poor people. I clearly mentioned using some money by their own will in order to create hospitals, food banks, or buying a large building to let some homeless people (or even animals) rest over night without having to pay. Such things do matter, without having to use so much money. And regarding what's needed to end world hunger for a year, according to UN officials it's 30 billion US dollars a year. (https://thomas-peham.com/projects/world-hunger)

By an estimate of 30 billion dollars, EVERY person in all first-world countries would have to pay $33.08 per YEAR (about €27.34) to end world hunger. That's three yearly Netflix subscription. Or one yearly Amazon prime fee.

Now that's something that I wouldn't mind if my taxes were to go to, in stead of some other random shit that the government uses it for.

- Once again, I didn't say they should be forced to donate, I am just saying in my eyes, it is unethical not to do so, knowing you could help a lot of lives. Oh and lets not forget that many big companies are related to child slave labour, hmm lets appreciate that... not.
« Last Edit: 14 02, 2021, 09:49:03 am by OhhKarim »

Offline Arran

  • Administrator
  • ******
  • Posts: 3307
  • Registered: 20/11/2010
    YearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYearsYears
  • Ingame: [CIT]Arran
Re: Is it unethical to be a billionaire?
« Reply #14 on: 14 02, 2021, 10:38:09 am »
Well it wouldn't be so bad billionaires hoarding billions if it wasn't for that money almost all is created as debt that people have to pay back and pay interest on so the less money in circulation means it's harder and for some impossible to pay their interest on so they are forced bankrupt and the bank takes their house, car, etc from them. And again this ties back to the world being controlled by a deep state.
Proof You Are so Much More Than What You Realise
Authority is not truth. Truth is authority.